I agree with you 100%. Preaching and Teaching the Word of God should be Spirit lead, let the Spirit of God speak rather then mans preparation and worldly wisdom and theology. We need preachers full of the Spirit God rather then taught how to preach. Rely on the Holy Spirit rather then the wisdom taught by man.
Galatians 1:11-12. I want you to know, brothers and sisters, that the gospel I preached is not of human origin. 12 I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.

I’m just an old English teacher, so take this for what it’s worth. The British poets are tops–including John Donne, Milton, George Herbert, Wordsworth, Christina Rosetti, W.H. Auden and (though he was very close to being a universalist), George MacDonald (Diary of an Old Soul). T.S. Eliot’s later works. Mystics: Blake and Gerard Manley Hopkins. The older I get, the more poetry (Christian poets) speak to me. Of the Americans, I really love Longfellow.

http://www.cleftintherock.org/2010/03/word-of-god-and-man-in-pulpit_2624.html

BK

Just want to add that Christ Reformed Church in Washington, DC will have T. David Gordon out to speak as a part of our “Preaching in the Capital” series this October, along with Gene Veith, Marva Dawn, and a speaker to be named later. Gordon will speak on Thursday, October 14, at 6:30 pm on the topic of Why Johnny Can’t Preach, but if we manage Q&A right we might get him to hold forth as well on Why Johnny Can’t Sing Hymns.

Look us up on Facebook to get our event updates. Thanks.

Disclaimer – Have not read the book

but on the use of media to enhance communication (namely PowerPoint)… what about all the learning theory that tells us to use as many different modes of communication as possible in order to enhance learning and increase retention/application etc

Any thoughts? Do you think this would help or hinder the flow of the service?

I highly recommend “The Oxford Book of … “… Children’s Verse”, “… English Verse”, and “… American Verse”, all of which I have found at used book sales for less than $5.

A final note: poetry is best read aloud, preferably more than once; it is helpful to hear how the “sound fits the sense” (apologies to Alexander Pope).

Fred Putnam

Agreed. Gordon is arguing for something that suits him quite well. Not a bad thing in itself…if you’ve got it, use it! Yet, this is certainly not the case that the Apostle Paul is making.

Nonetheless, I so appreciate his assessment of Reformed churches today…in too many cases being equivalent to mainline Liberal churches with their moralistic accent. The ol’ Law-Gospel-Law paradigm in action.

Peace,
Matthew

T. David Gordon

I’d like an answer to that question too! I can ask around and try to post something when I get some suggestions.

Thanks,

Mark

The irony about what Paul says about his preaching is that if his letter writing is anything to go by then he was a very skilled rhetoritian. What Paul is getting at to the Corinthians (I think) is that the power of his arguements didn’t depend on rhetoric. In their culture they were more concerned with style than content. Paul’s point is that what counts is the content of the gospel. He refused to employ certain techniques that were dishonest (flattery for example). But I have no doubt that he used the science of rhetoric. It’s all over his letters.

Generally speaking, I want to support the idea of reading poetry. This advice was given to me by a very liberal preacher when I was a young man. It was probably the only good advice he could give! Since then I have read poetry regularly. Not to quote (though sometimes I do) but more to stimulate the mind, to open the mind to description and terseness of thought. If you don’t know where to start just buy an anthology of the classics.

Isn’t there something a little odd about Gordon’s thesis?

I haven’t read the book yet, but –prima facie– when Paul says that his own preaching lacked “wisdom of words” (1 Cor 1:17) … I always took that to mean both in substance (ie, not so-called wisdom apart from Christ) and in form (ie, not polished rhetorical style). Paul seems to indicate that his lack of rhetoric was actually fit for the gospel ministry, as it is marked primarily by the Spirit’s efficacy, and not an effect enhanced by following the natural laws of good public speaking.
I’m surprised this issue didn’t come up in the interview (or I don’t remember it being mentioned).

I don’t think the import of this would be that Paul is encouraging preachers to cultivate poor public speaking, but rather, to put it briefly, if Johnny can’t preach, then it’s because he’s not genuinely preaching Christ.

In my own experience (in various NAPARC denominations) the preaching is so poor because these the preachers still don’t believe that the Word rightly preached only and ever ultimately proclaims two things [in all its various particular ways]: 1) the person of Christ and His definitive accomplishment of full redemption for His people, and 2) how this applies to His people in union with Him.

None of this undermines the validity of oratory, rhetoric, and “media ecology” or whathaveyou. It’s just to say that the theological fundamentals still seem to be at stake. And Paul’s testimony seems to be that these fundamentals are both necessary and sufficient for “good preaching,” poor rhetoric not withstanding.

I’d love some feedback on this.

I want to apologize to everyone up front for the audio quality. For various reasons, I’ve had to use different equipment for this episode (and the next). The excessive noises won’t be an issue in the future (at least after the next episode).